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Zombies => Metal & Talk (english) => Thema gestartet von: Mas am Januar 05, 2005, 01:25:55 Vormittag

Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Mas am Januar 05, 2005, 01:25:55 Vormittag
lol shadow  :P i am thinking to build a bleeding4metal castle!!!!!!!! we all can stay there :wink:

Now i have someting serious about the Netherlands,

I saw today at some american televsion news programs about The Netherlands, and what they told about the netherlands is not nice, but most of it it is overact and not true :?

The newsprograms talk about that here in the Netherlands little baby's get killed in the hospital if they have someting wrong, i wanna tell everyone this is not true!
eutanism here is a very very difficult way to go. what they told on the news is about baby's who are born with a lot of pain and who dont have any change to live,  this baby's gonna die soon and they have a lot of pain we cant discribe. and yes i agree if someone will let them baby sleep forever when it have so much pain and you know for sure that its gonna die soon.  so its not like my baby have 9 fingers we kill it... that is not true! its not true.

I saw also news about the Moslim population here, yeah its true a very famous artist and film maker is killed by moslim extremists, but its not that we now live in a more dangerous country than other country's.

i saw also news about the red light district, believe me or not but the red light district is my favorite place to hang around when i go out.
there are not more prostituees in amsterdam than in Hamburg or other country's. the red light disctrict is a safe district with a lot of local cool and very nice cafe's. and even a lot of girls there are very nice and they just do them work. we dont have to like what they do but  they dont have to like what i do, i am happy with the girls because a lot of guy's need them, and trust me this girls are doing it safe.

its also not true that everyone smoke weed here,  i think the coffeeshops  get the most money from the tourists, i know good coffeeshops here and i also know the rules.

all this news i saw today is realy overact. that bother me.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Virvatuli am Januar 05, 2005, 11:36:20 Vormittag
Must've been some stupid program. I don't believe anyone here would believe that kinda things, at least I wouldn't.
I didn't know that eutanasia is legal there?
I hope it would be legal here too...
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Mas am Januar 05, 2005, 11:45:55 Vormittag
yeah eutanasia is legal but its a long way to go, and many rulez, someone need to be very very ill, with no any change to get health, i know that because my kids granmom has braincancer and when she ask for eutanasia, it took 2 weeks before we get round everyting, and i promised her that she dont need have to more pain, but it took so long before she got the eutanasia, to long.

ill hope it will be legal soon in Finland. yeah.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Virvatuli am Januar 05, 2005, 11:52:43 Vormittag
Yep. It's really awful to the old people, escpecially; they just put them to these machines here and forget all about them. Is that life anymore :/
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Mas am Januar 05, 2005, 12:10:20 Nachmittag
you right and thats with little children too, i think its selfisch when people say eutanasia is not right, nobody deserve to live in a hell filt with pain.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: The Metal RN am Januar 05, 2005, 02:08:33 Nachmittag
That is a really sticky subject here. I am all in favor for it, working in hospitals I have seen more than my share of people suffer needlessly. There is a big change in the way pain is looked at here in teh US, but sometimes there is only so much you can do. I think more education needs to be doen and people need to think about death in realistic terms, it  will happen, and people need to dicuss with loved ones what they want done before it gets to the point where the decision has to be made, make out a living will. Sorry for the more political posts today (Scary thread as well  :?  :(  ) It has just been the subject matter and I just woke up not too long ago... I will try to do something stupid for ya today!!
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Metalmaiden am Januar 05, 2005, 03:19:29 Nachmittag
With regard to this  -- we treat our animals better than people here!

It is a very sad state in medicine. Doctors are afraid to prescribe pain medication to sick and dying patients for fear that they, the doctor,  will be prosecuted by the government because of the strict regulations on those types of drugs and the fact that euthenasia is  absolutely illegal here. (except in one state but they can't do it because the federal over seeing government doesn't allow it.)

There is also strong opposition to allowing euthenasia from those who believe it will be miss used, opening the way up for state sanctioned genocide.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Mas am Januar 05, 2005, 04:32:45 Nachmittag
Zitat von: "The Metal RN"
That is a really sticky subject here. I am all in favor for it, working in hospitals I have seen more than my share of people suffer needlessly. There is a big change in the way pain is looked at here in teh US, but sometimes there is only so much you can do. I think more education needs to be doen and people need to think about death in realistic terms, it  will happen, and people need to dicuss with loved ones what they want done before it gets to the point where the decision has to be made, make out a living will. Sorry for the more political posts today (Scary thread as well  :?  :(  ) It has just been the subject matter and I just woke up not too long ago... I will try to do something stupid for ya today!!


i think that is a good point, i know how hard it is to talk about this things in US, i know there are a lot of people want to change this things. yeah it is a scary thread but what kind of stupid are you gonna do today  :roll: lol, be carefull please  :wink:
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Mas am Januar 05, 2005, 04:35:09 Nachmittag
Zitat von: "Metalmaiden"
With regard to this  -- we treat our animals better than people here!

.


Here you go! right to the point! its here the same, a lot of people treat animals better. yeah.
not that i hate animals but my kids and your kids are more important than my dog. thats the true.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Jeanny am Januar 06, 2005, 12:41:39 Nachmittag
Zitat von: "Mas"
Zitat von: "Metalmaiden"
With regard to this  -- we treat our animals better than people here!

.


Here you go! right to the point! its here the same, a lot of people treat animals better. yeah. .


I think that the reason why some people animals treats better is that they have bad experiences with other people. There are a lot of annoying people on this world, and if you got a pet, and it is good raised, the pet mostly will always love you, and give you warmth. no matter what you do.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: shadowman am Januar 06, 2005, 09:58:07 Nachmittag
Wohow ! Just checked out the Holland topic as I thought there were no news posts, but boy how wrong was I .
Delicate topic indeed this Euthanasia thing... :roll:
Who can tell when a person is not going to get well anymore...
A very thin line between life and death...

I remember a song called 'Euthanasia' by Tygers of Pan Tang.
I should check on the lyrics again since the Tygers era dates over 20 years ago.
But the only thing I remember about the chorus :
'Euthanasia ? Ok !'
'All the way, oh yeah...'

So... Guess they were all for it right ?

 :o
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Souleraser am Januar 06, 2005, 10:29:54 Nachmittag
Just a sidenote, as this discussion took an interesting turn which didn't really belong to the "Netherlands" any longer: new topic for this one.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: shadowman am Januar 06, 2005, 10:31:54 Nachmittag
Good idea Aop, "the mighty topic-splitter" !!

 :D
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Mas am Januar 06, 2005, 10:31:55 Nachmittag
ok thank u AoP  :) i think this is a intresting topic
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: AngelOfMusic am Januar 07, 2005, 08:26:37 Vormittag
I don't pay much attention to international events as covered by the US news (When our news stations actually show international affairs...it's very rare.)  After getting a taste of the BBC World News when I was in London, I feel very deprived.

As for the Euthanasia issue...We went over this in my Ethics class this past fall.  I would support it in certain cases, and as long as the doctor wasn't doing it to gain attention and try and defy authority, like I believe Dr. Kevorkian was doing.  I really don't think that man had the patients' best interest in mind.  I think he was serving only himself.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Metalmaiden am Januar 07, 2005, 02:50:30 Nachmittag
Zitat von: "AngelOfMusic"
I don't pay much attention to international events as covered by the US news (When our news stations actually show international affairs...it's very rare.)  After getting a taste of the BBC World News when I was in London, I feel very deprived.


I would agree with you on this one. Even CNN World shown in Europe was more in formative and factual than the CNN seen in the USA. I have Satelite TV and am able to watch BBC World and that's generally my first source here at home.

Zitat
I would support it in certain cases, and as long as the doctor wasn't doing it to gain attention and try and defy authority, like I believe Dr. Kevorkian was doing.  I really don't think that man had the patients' best interest in mind.  I think he was serving only himself.


I am not all that sure what Dr Kevorkian's motives were but you must give credit to him for the fact that it brought the issue to the forefront and created a national discussion that lasted for several years.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Souleraser am Januar 07, 2005, 03:12:24 Nachmittag
Dangerous and sticky topic.

I'm a firm believer in the right of self-determination, therefore I sure believe a person should have the right to chose time, date and occasion of his or death. And I believe parents should have the right do decide if a child or baby really has to suffer being kept alive by machines for months or years - and the other way round of course also.

Though especially the last one is difficult because financial issues could matter.

A really dangerous topic but I believe politicians should deal with it soon.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Jeanny am Januar 07, 2005, 05:17:16 Nachmittag
I wanna react on the first post from Mas. She is right, about all the subjects. Thy will describe the Netherlands as a dangerous country, but in every country or land there will be problems. Amsterdam is the place to be I'ts a really nice town. The red light ditrict is abolutely a nice place indeed with a lot of cosy cafe's. About the moslims the opinions  here are different. In that describing its all overreact.  About euthanasia , I think that some people have the right to take the decision, especially when someone really suffers and there is no more option for a really normal live. I believe (I.m not really sure) that in our land you can sign an euthanasia paper, so you don't need to suffer endless. I find that a good  point.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Metalmaiden am Februar 18, 2005, 03:31:34 Nachmittag
Just thinking about this topic again because there are currently two movies out here in the US that deal with this topic.
Both deal with people with non-fatal  illness. Each involves a  paralyzed person (quadriplegic) who wish to die.
One is a fictionalized real story. One is based on a fiction short story.
Those movies are "The Sea Inside" and "Million Dollar Baby".
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Souleraser am Februar 18, 2005, 05:10:02 Nachmittag
"Million Dollar Baby", this one?
http://imdb.com/title/tt0405159/

"The Sea inside", this one?
http://imdb.com/title/tt0369702/

Notes taken, looking forward to see them over here.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Metalmaiden am Februar 18, 2005, 06:06:27 Nachmittag
You are good  Basti!  Always  on top of things.
Yes that's them.

I'd be interested, if you or anybody here, sees them, to know what your thought.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: The Metal RN am Februar 18, 2005, 06:07:23 Nachmittag
Yes.
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Iron Man am Februar 20, 2005, 07:25:21 Nachmittag
I Hate the Press!!!!  :evil:
They always do that with other countries
Brazil isn't that dream, but they twist it making it looks 100 times worst than it is!
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: dorian jane am April 07, 2005, 02:00:11 Vormittag
Very interesting topic !! As a matter of fact it concerns me the most, as i deal with my mother having the Parkinson desease for 17 years and being handicaped for about 8 years. That's in fact the reason i moved from my house in Thessaloniki, quit my job and been living with my parents for about two years now. (Built my own house for privacy , but still taking care of them).This whole situation made me do a LOT of thinking.....
I would never decide for herself, cause you see life so sweet and she hopes to be a hundred.Nor i support the idea of deciding for others. But, we can decide for ourselves.
All i want to say is that if, or when, i become unable to support myself, i wish euthanasia is legal in Greece.(one can just hope , don't you agree? ).

Lots of quotes, won't put them here.But still..
@Mas: I visited Amsterdam, it's a great city, the red light district is my favourite too.Here's to the Bulldog coffee shops!!!  I wish there was a city in Greece like Amsterdam...
@Shadowman: though i know you only from yr postings, Tigers of Pan Tang !! I thought i was among the few left who remembers that band
@AoP: Do you know that in ancient Greece the Spartans threw the ill and handicaped children off a mountain called Kaiadas? Not only for these children or their families not to suffer but cause when growing up they wouldn't be able neither to support themselves nor the Spartan community.

And all these just gave me the idea of a new topic...
Titel: Euthanasia
Beitrag von: Souleraser am April 07, 2005, 08:18:04 Vormittag
Zitat von: "dorian jane"

@AoP: Do you know that in ancient Greece the Spartans threw the ill and handicaped children off a mountain called Kaiadas? Not only for these children or their families not to suffer but cause when growing up they wouldn't be able neither to support themselves nor the Spartan community.


Sure. We're being taught that in 6th grade's history at the age of 11 or 12. I didn't know the name of the rock, but I knew the rite.